For Wednesday: “The
Oxford Scholar’s Tale”
Answer TWO of
the following:
Q1: The Oxford
Scholar, befitting his status as a scholar, tells a story borrowed from
the Italian poet Petrarch (a real poet and a contemporary of Chaucer's). Why do you think
Chaucer has him do this? Why not tell a modern story of marriage set in England like the Miller? Is it for the same reason as The Wife of Bath tells her story in King
Arthur’s Time? Or the Knight in ancient Greece?
Q2: How do you
think the story of Griselda is a
commentary (or response) to The Wife of Bath’s Prologue/Tale? Is he responding
to the ill-treatment of medieval wives, or is he responding to the literary tradition of evil, nagging women? Do you
think the Tale sympathizes with the Wife of Bath or lampoons her? Is his Griselda
an ideal—as he later claims—or a tragic victim?
Q3: The Scholar
quotes Petrarch at the end of his tale, who apparently said,“this tale has not
been told so that wives should/Imitate Griselda in humility;/They’d find it
intolerable if they did!/But that everyone, whatever his degree,/Should be as
steadfast in adversity/as Griselda.” Is the story supposed to be an updated version
of The Book of Job, where the class/gender of Griselda is irrelevant? Or do you
feel that the story makes more sense when it’s about a woman and a peasant? (in other words, is this a universal story or a very specific one?)
1- In my opinion, a story set in the past is subconsciously telling its audience: " Before you get upset, just remember that you cannot change the past. Now what can we learn from the following story?" A story set in the past seems to dissociate itself from the reader, thus making it more genteel. Because the story is supposedly so old, it gains a bit of authority, much like a proverb, parable, or fable. It also seems to add a literary sense of Romanticism to the piece.
ReplyDelete2- This story is almost the exact opposite of the Wife's tale. The woman in this tale is ordered to do this and that in order to prove her loyalty as opposed to gaining authority over man. I imagine that the Oxford Scholar and the Wife would not see everything in the same light, but I don't think that they would completely disagree either. I feel that the Scholar is trying to say that women should not be completely submissive to their husbands, but should still be honest and loyal. The Wife is more pro-feminism, and the Scholar seems pro-equality.
Q1. I feel like the scholar chooses this "Once upon a time," format because it makes it easier to capture the attention of your audience. Especially, in this case, when the audience has to listen to you and you're trying to share a "lesson". When a story is set in a distant time or place, there is almost always a moral or lesson hidden in the tale. The Knight, the Wife of Bath, and the Oxford Scholar all are trying to get their ideals across to their audience, while the miller is just lampooning relationships, women, and the knight's lack of ability at story telling.
ReplyDeleteQ4. The scholar seems to point out the idea, and accusation that the Wife of Bath makes, that all clerks/learned men who write are against women and misogynistic. I this this is the millers way of saying, " Its obvious that a woman like Griselda doesn't exist, and if she did exist then she died a long time ago and her unwavering patience and servitude left with her. So, its ridiculous to expect women to act in that way and then also villainize them." I think he respects and commends the Wife of Bath's learnedness and boldness to speak out. He also calls for more women to do so! But, he points out that his story is meant to be seen as how a Christian should be obedient in their relationship with God.
3. I do get the sense that this tale shares some parallels with the story of Job. I find that the gender of the Griselda isn’t entirely irrelevant, as the tale wouldn’t be a response to the wife of Bath otherwise, but that she does represent humanity. We as people are taken from a place of poverty (i.e. sin, despair, transgression) and brought, not by our own power, into the presence of the marquis (God) who loves us and does allow us to experience trial. When we are faithful and steadfast, and trust in the sovereignty of our lord, we are beneficiaries. For the scholar to tell a story of a woman who had grown up in poverty as opposed to Job, a man of great wealth, and to make her out to be humble, loyal, and loving was something quite contradictory to the literature at the time. As per the Petrarch quote, everyone, even men, ought to see the life of Griselda as a sort of standard to be met when faced with adversity – something women experience daily.
ReplyDelete4. The song was sang to further establish that the tale was not to represent how a woman ought to live for her husband, but how a human ought to live – steadfast, loyal, unchanging. The song is something of a message to women and wives. The song states that the patience of Griselda is dead. If her patience is dead, there is no point for anyone to attempt to gain it. Therefore, it only makes sense for women to stand up for themselves in their relationships with their husbands. It is as if the Clerk is taking the Petrarchan moral from the tale – being steadfast to the desires of the husband (or God if one subscribes to the idea of the tale being Job-esquely related to humanity) and denying it in regards to the wife.
1. By inserting works from Petrarch, this allows a realism to enter into the story that makes it somewhat more relatable to the peoples of that time and custom while distancing the story from the present world. In some ways the Knights tale and that of the Wife of Bath did the same. This allows a distant and more objective view of the lesson that is meant to be taught while working to also make the story relatable.
ReplyDelete3. Reading the Scholars tale, I found the morals to be very similar to that of the book of Job and that there seemed to be definite connections. However, I also find that there was heavy emphasis on the fact that our character who was suffering is a woman. Social class did not seem to stand out significantly overall but to see a woman portrayed in such a perfect light during a time when women were looked down on gives the impression that the story teller has a very high regard for women. Chaucer seemed to be telling his audience that this educated scholar saw women in a different light than both the Knight and the Wife of Bath. That woman is not inferior to men as the knight subtly suggested but in some ways superior. However, he does not seem to share the idea that women are as underhanded as the wife of Bath suggests.
Question 2: I believe The Clerk is responding to The Wife of Bathe’s story in way that he is agreeing with her view of the treatment of woman without coming right out and saying that. The Wife of Bathe’s story to the other is so out worldly and implausible that while she gets her point across people scoff it off as never happening, or able to happen. The Clerk on the other hand reinforced The Wife of Bathe’s tale by making it relatable and realistic. He dramatizes the true actions of men and treatment of women of that day and age. This allows the others to see that The Wife of Bathe’s story hold some truth. While, as we discussed in class, there are no Griseldas in the world she does portray perfectly the role a wife is accepted to play. They see how low the standards are, and actually begin to sympathize.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 3: I believe the story can be taken universally with specific examples. Sometimes when a story is told but the examples are all universal it can be unclear what the exact lesson is. By The Clerk giving the specific example of a wife being mistreated by her husband or a peasant being abused by royalty, you are aware that these people need to stand up for themselves. Therefore, you are able to realize the moral The Clerk wanted to get across was no one should take abuse by another, and one should always stand up for his or herself. Class/gender are completely irrelevant.
2. I think that this is a response to the Wife of Bath as a result of the way he uses the characters within the story. Instead of doing a similar thing that she does within her piece, I think that purposefully does the opposite so that he could reveal to those on the pilgrimage how women of that day felt. It’s curious that he, an Oxford scholar, would tell this story, being that due to his vast amount of knowledge when he could literally talk about anything else. I think the reason he picks this tale is to sympathize with his woman audience, specifically the Wife of Bath. He paints Griselda as a poor, helpless lady to depict how absurd it is for men of that time to want a wife to be so submissive. He doesn’t agree with this story and lets the audience know it by his use of words. An example of this as previously stated in lecture is on page 222, lines 12-14 “But as for me, I think it wrong and bad/For man to test his wife when it is needless,/And subject her to fright, dismay, and anguish.”
ReplyDelete4. I could be completely wrong with my observation about the song he sings at the end, but it is my theory he does it to come back to the reality he knows exist. He knows that men will not but submissive as in the Wife of Bath’s tale and that those in the crowd must think of his tale as “crazy talk.” This is his way of relaxing the crowd, the “humor break” in a movie if you will. I read the Oxford Scholar as a humble man trying to make light of his story telling that more than likely had many individual on their toes. The reason why I say this is because on page 209, the host goes into a long discourse about how they had yet to hear to hear from the Scholar, especially in line 2 with saying “Today I haven’t heard you speak a word.”
QA1). Chaucer has The Oxford Scholar tell a story borrowed from the poet of Petrarch in order to stress to the people of that time how ridiculous that model of life is. He does not tell a modern story because he understands that in order to get the most attention from his listeners, he’d need to spruce the story up. The easiest way to do that is to tell a story of old. We could even argue that the reason he does this is in fact to stress that the Wife of Bath’s tale is fiction and should not be taken seriously nor shall his.
ReplyDeleteQA2). The story of Griselda is a response to the Wife of Bath’s tale. The Scholar even mentions her towards the end of the story. He is responding yes, slightly, to the ill treatment of medieval wives but mostly he is responding to the traditional view that woman are evil and should be doormats. His Griselda is a tragic victim in our eyes yet, as a Scholar, we have to assume he does not understand what it is to be with a woman and this might just be his ideal.
Dana Welch
ReplyDeleteQ1 I think the reason that the clerk tells the story is because he may have found it interesting and informative and thought that it really bent the perspective on how women were thought of and how they should act in these days according to men's theories and at the end in the song, it seems as if Chaucer is trying to tell women to stand up for themselves and not to take the b.s. that men give them.
Q4. I think that it's a warning to all who seek marriage. Men and women. It is a warning and advice on what to expect from your wife or husband. Also it gives specific details on how a woman should REALLY behave and expect from a marriage.
Dana Welch
ReplyDeleteQ1 I think the reason that the clerk tells the story is because he may have found it interesting and informative and thought that it really bent the perspective on how women were thought of and how they should act in these days according to men's theories and at the end in the song, it seems as if Chaucer is trying to tell women to stand up for themselves and not to take the b.s. that men give them.
Q4. I think that it's a warning to all who seek marriage. Men and women. It is a warning and advice on what to expect from your wife or husband. Also it gives specific details on how a woman should REALLY behave and expect from a marriage.